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12/17/2010 10:58 am
artie_fufkin wrote:
Great stuff. I always enjoy reading your historical perspective. And Stan's. I haven't heard from Stan in awhile.
Thanks, Artie. I guess reminisces can get pretty boring at times.
If you'd like to get a flavor to the song, you can play about 15 seconds of it at Amazon.com:
And I just discovered that you can listen to the whole song on youtube:
If you should happen to listen to it, the "White Team" referred to in the song was their second team.
12/17/2010 10:38 am
Great stuff. I always enjoy reading your historical perspective. And Stan's. I haven't heard from Stan in awhile.
12/17/2010 9:42 am
"Once they came out of the game they couldn't come back until the next quarter."
I never knew that. What was the rationale?
The dumbest substitution rule is in pro soccer. You're only allowed three subs per game. If you've already used your three subs and one of the players on the field breaks his leg, you have to play the rest of the way with 10 men. Even though you've got a half-dozen guys sitting on the sidelines who haven't played.
Franz Beckenbauer once had to play with his arm in a sling during a World Cup game because his team had already used its subs before he broke his clavicle.
I think it was called "One-Platoon" football and the idea was to put the small schools on an even keel with the large ones. I really don't think anyone can conceive of just how much the perception of college athletics has changed over the years. Most of the people my age have managed to adjust their values over the years as things have changed and others never really knew or cared to begin with. The rest of you can look at the stats but its impossible for you to grasp the difference in the climate.
Remember also that Freshmen were not eligible to play varsity football in those days. They had to complete the first year with a significant number of academic credits (about 12 hours per semester minimum) and had to have something like a 2.00 grade average. Also, grading was much different in those days. I know one guy who is exactly my age who had a 2.42 undergrad GPA and was surprised to learn when he was applying for graduate law study that he'd finished in the top half of his class.
One platoon football began around 1953 and lasted more or less until my last semester (Fall 1964). Thanks to the efforts of folks like Frank Broyles, they began to chip away at the rule by allowing certain exceptions -- called wild card substitution. Many teams used it for the punter and the quarterback. During Lance Alworth's last couple of years, he only played offense and a linebacker/center named Wayne Harris only played defense except in emergencies. Keep in mind also that there wasn't as much scoring as there is today and you often didn't need a kicker more than once a quarter. Also, when you did, one of the regulars would kick.
When the first team needed a blow, the coach would substitute an entire second unit that would play offense and defense. One of Paul Dietzel's innovations at LSU was to create a third team that played almost exclusively defense and called them the "Chinese Bandits" after the characters in the cartoon strip, "Terry and the Pirates." These were said to be guys lacking the all around athletic skill of the first two teams but who made up for it by being incredibly reckless and vicious, like the characters in the cartoon strip. There was a popular song about them during Billy Cannon's senior year.
Frankly, I liked the one platoon football because it forced the players to carry much less weight and I liked the freshman ineligible rule because it gave at least some of them a chance to get involved in academics since the Freshman team didn't travel that much.
12/16/2010 11:57 pm
"In those days, they seemed to have a different way of looking at the game."
No doubt. He looks like he'd be a wide receiver if he played today.He was 6'6" 225. I think that it was primarily due to the fact that people were smaller in those days and they didn't have anything that bore a resemblance to the strength training that future jocks begin working on when they are 7 years old. But the weight factor is also a product of the rule that players had to play both ways. Once they came out of the game they couldn't come back until the next quarter. In Chapman's case, however, he was a sophomore or junior before that experiment was adopted. The biggest guy we had at Arkansas my first three years (about 5 or 6 years after Chapman's days) was a tackle named Jerry Mazzanti, who weighed 220 or thereabouts.
Once of my first football cards was a tackle for the San Francisco 49er's named Bob St. Clair, who was about the biggest guy in pro football. My guess is that he was about 6'6" 260. He apparently caused something of a problem with some of Frisco's finest restaurants because of his love of a very high quality, extra large steak. The problem was that he insisted on eating his steaks raw and some of the other patrons found it a bit unappetizing. I think those who complained did so with the management.
A few years later, the Baltimore Colts were the talk of football with their "huge" front four, which included "Big Daddy" Lipscomb and Don Joyce. I can't recall their weight but I suspect they would both weigh less than the average today.Incidentally, Alan Page was almost exactly the same size as Chapman when after he lost so much weight and the Vikings let him go.
Alan Page will probably have for eternity the distinction of being the last defensive lineman to be named MVP of the NFL.
12/16/2010 11:56 pm
"Once they came out of the game they couldn't come back until the next quarter."
I never knew that. What was the rationale?
The dumbest substitution rule is in pro soccer. You're only allowed three subs per game. If you've already used your three subs and one of the players on the field breaks his leg, you have to play the rest of the way with 10 men. Even though you've got a half-dozen guys sitting on the sidelines who haven't played.
Franz Beckenbauer once had to play with his arm in a sling during a World Cup game because his team had already used its subs before he broke his clavicle.
12/16/2010 11:04 pm
And speaking of guys that were part of the Colts' defensive line in the late 50's:
12/16/2010 10:47 pm
"In those days, they seemed to have a different way of looking at the game."
No doubt. He looks like he'd be a wide receiver if he played today.He was 6'6" 225. I think that it was primarily due to the fact that people were smaller in those days and they didn't have anything that bore a resemblance to the strength training that future jocks begin working on when they are 7 years old. But the weight factor is also a product of the rule that players had to play both ways. Once they came out of the game they couldn't come back until the next quarter. In Chapman's case, however, he was a sophomore or junior before that experiment was adopted. The biggest guy we had at Arkansas my first three years (about 5 or 6 years after Chapman's days) was a tackle named Jerry Mazzanti, who weighed 220 or thereabouts.
Once of my first football cards was a tackle for the San Francisco 49er's named Bob St. Clair, who was about the biggest guy in pro football. My guess is that he was about 6'6" 260. He apparently caused something of a problem with some of Frisco's finest restaurants because of his love of a very high quality, extra large steak. The problem was that he insisted on eating his steaks raw and some of the other patrons found it a bit unappetizing. I think those who complained did so with the management.
A few years later, the Baltimore Colts were the talk of football with their "huge" front four, which included "Big Daddy" Lipscomb and Don Joyce. I can't recall their weight but I suspect they would both weigh less than the average today.
Incidentally, Alan Page was almost exactly the same size as Chapman when after he lost so much weight and the Vikings let him go.
12/16/2010 10:37 pm
"In those days, they seemed to have a different way of looking at the game."
No doubt. He looks like he'd be a wide receiver if he played today.
He was 6'6" 225. I think that it was primarily due to the fact that people were smaller in those days and they didn't have anything that bore a resemblance to the strength training that future jocks begin working on when they are 7 years old. But the weight factor is also a product of the rule that players had to play both ways. Once they came out of the game they couldn't come back until the next quarter. In Chapman's case, however, he was a sophomore or junior before that experiment was adopted. The biggest guy we had at Arkansas my first three years (about 5 or 6 years after Chapman's days) was a tackle named Jerry Mazzanti, who weighed 220 or thereabouts.
Once of my first football cards was a tackle for the San Francisco 49er's named Bob St. Clair, who was about the biggest guy in pro football. My guess is that he was about 6'6" 260. He apparently caused something of a problem with some of Frisco's finest restaurants because of his love of a very high quality, extra large steak. The problem was that he insisted on eating his steaks raw and some of the other patrons found it a bit unappetizing. I think those who complained did so with the management.
A few years later, the Baltimore Colts were the talk of football with their "huge" front four, which included "Big Daddy" Lipscomb and Don Joyce. I can't recall their weight but I suspect they would both weigh less than the average today.
12/16/2010 9:04 pm
"In those days, they seemed to have a different way of looking at the game."
No doubt. He looks like he'd be a wide receiver if he played today.
12/16/2010 4:16 pm
Artie,
In our early discussions of Rice football and the Tommy Lewis tackle, I think I mentioned that my first "favorite player" was a guy named Dick Chapman at Rice who was an All-American along with Maegle and who was running almost step for step with him on that infamous play. I can't confirm that he ever played pro ball even though he was a number 1 draft choice by the Detroit Lions. He would have graduated from Rice around 1955 at the earliest. By 1957, he had earned his Ph.D. in Nukelear Physics.
Here's an article on this remarkable man:
Can you imagine today an interior lineman being named co-MVP with a teammate like Maegle, who had scored something like 3 or 4 touchdowns and was credited with a 95 yd run?
In those days, they seemed to have a different way of looking at the game.
12/16/2010 12:31 pm
I call b.s.
Lord Acton was a linebacker, not a quarterback.I stand corrected. But he was teammates with King Hill.
Speaking of King Hill's teammates, did you know Frank Ryan was the only QB in NFL history to earn a Ph.D. in mathematics while still an active player?
Except for Dan Marino, of course.
I knew he had done so but didn't know for sure he was the only one. Guess right or die, I'd have said he was. I wonder how many players have taught at Yale while playing in the NFL?
Who was it that said about Ryan that the Browns had a QB who could explain the theory of relativity and 10 other starters that didn't know there was one?
Other than Charlie Johnson, how many players have earned a Ph.D. in Engineering while playing? I think his was in Chem Eng. from Wash. U. (not U. Wash.)
12/16/2010 11:53 am
I call b.s.
Lord Acton was a linebacker, not a quarterback.I stand corrected. But he was teammates with King Hill.
Speaking of King Hill's teammates, did you know Frank Ryan was the only QB in NFL history to earn a Ph.D. in mathematics while still an active player?
Except for Dan Marino, of course.
12/16/2010 11:05 am
I call b.s.
Lord Acton was a linebacker, not a quarterback.
I stand corrected. But he was teammates with King Hill.
12/16/2010 9:53 am
It looks like the University of Memphis will be getting a very large donation to their athletic program if they have the same starting QB next fall:
How bad a kid do you have to be for the University of Miami to chuck you?
I don't know but this guy had an older brother who created a huge controversy at the University of Va. as a wrestler when he was involved in an incident that left another boy paralyzed. There apparently were widespread protests by students over the leniency shown the Smith kid by the school administration. He later was admitted to a law school (not the University of Memphis), which has since received a very large contribution to its endowment.
Think Lord Acton.
I call b.s.
Lord Acton was a linebacker, not a quarterback.
12/15/2010 10:20 pm
It looks like the University of Memphis will be getting a very large donation to their athletic program if they have the same starting QB next fall:
How bad a kid do you have to be for the University of Miami to chuck you?
I don't know but this guy had an older brother who created a huge controversy at the University of Va. as a wrestler when he was involved in an incident that left another boy paralyzed. There apparently were widespread protests by students over the leniency shown the Smith kid by the school administration. He later was admitted to a law school (not the University of Memphis), which has since received a very large contribution to its endowment.
Think Lord Acton.