"During the course of preparing for my successful appeal last year, my attorneys, who were previously familiar with Tony Bosch, used him as a consultant. More specifically, he answered questions about T/E ratio and possibilities of tampering with samples.There was a dispute over compensation for Bosch’s work, which is why my lawyer and I are listed under ‘moneys owed’ and not on any other list.I have nothing to hide and have never had any other relationship with Bosch.I will fully cooperate with any inquiry into this matter.”

I am not convinced Braun did anything wrong . . . yet.

What would be a HUGE step for MLB, would be to allow clubs to void the contract of a player who gets suspended for PED.  A-Rod could the remaining 9 figures on his contract good-bye.

artie_fufkin wrote:

If I guy wants to use his liver as a toxic waste filter and watch his testicles shrink to the size of raisins in exchange for fame and enough wealth to keep him and the next 10 generations of his family comfortable, then who's problem is it? Ours, or his?

Ours.

tkihshbt wrote:

Why ours?

Hypothetically, 90% of the guys in your field decide they want to imbibe an elixir that improves their performance 1000%, and cuts their life expectancy to 10% of average.  Now, where do "we" draw the line?
 

Max wrote:

I am not convinced Braun did anything wrong . . . yet.

What would be a HUGE step for MLB, would be to allow clubs to void the contract of a player who gets suspended for PED.  A-Rod could the remaining 9 figures on his contract good-bye.

i am more then convinced.  I mean he has test positive and got off because of halfass procedure.  Now this case is less then great.  I am convinced he is a user but unsure if their proof is good enough.  One thing is for sure, if he gets off a second time the mlb heads will hate him like no player before.

Taking away pay is an excelent idea.

Max wrote:

My recollection with Braun is that he tested positive for a substance that was part of his medical treatment to recover from an injury.  Yes, that could be bullshit, but my recollection was that the pieces of the puzzle fit together.

Once again, with this one, it sounds like the pieces of the puzzle fit: we hired him for our defense and there was an outstanding bill for his consulting fees.  

Braun tested positive for massively high levels of testosterone and won his appeal because the courier didn't immediately deliver his sample to the Fed Ex place.

For months Braun spewed some bullshit about how he intended to prove he never took PEDs, but when the actual hearing came about, the only defense proffered was a chain of custody issue.  No injury, no medical treatment.  Pure technicality.

ETA- there was a rumor that Braun was taking medication for herpes, but that was never substantiated.

From the Yahoo article that first broke the story

"While Braun never contested the findings of the test, which found elevated testosterone levels in his urine, a 50-game suspension was overturned after chain-of-custody issues arose from the test-taker keeping the specimen in his basement over the weekend instead of immediately shipping it to a testing lab. Braun denied use of testosterone publicly.

The early portion of MLB's investigation has focused on the web of connections to the University of Miami, where Braun attended college. Carrillo, a pitcher in the Detroit Tigers organization, was Braun's road roommate for three years. Jimmy Goins, a strength-and-conditioning coach at the school and alleged client of Bosch's, worked with Braun during his three years at Miami. Goins has denied a connection to Bosch.

At least two others implicated by the New Times – Washington Nationals pitcher Gio Gonzalez and San Diego Padres catcher Yasmani Grandal – have worked with Goins. Grandal, Cabrera and Bartolo Colon, all listed in Bosch's records, were suspended by MLB after testing positive for testosterone this season. MLB is considering pursuing further discipline against them, particularly if the league can acquire records that tie players to PEDs on different dates than their positive tests."


Here are some puzzle pieces that fit.

- The Biogenesis Clinic sells synthetic testosterone
- Ryan Braun's former trainer has links to the Biogenesis Clinic.
- 2011, Ryan Braun tested positive for synthetic testosterone.
- 2012, Ryan Braun's name is found in a ledger of the Biogenesis Clinic
- The Biogenesis Clinic is located in Miami and is linked to a number of athletes who either grew up in Miami or attended the University of Miami
- Ryan Braun attended the University of Miami.
- Several other clients of the Biogenesis Clinic have tested positive and been suspended by MLB for testing positive for synthetic testosterone.
- At Ryan Braun's hearing, Braun's defense team did not present any witness to testify about any substance given to Braun that would explain his elevated testosterone level, nor did they present any evidence to refute the results of Braun's test.
 

Last edited by forsberg_us (6/06/2013 1:59 pm)

well, when you put it like that it sounds like he's guilty as hell.

come to think of it, i wonder where their contracts can't be voided?  if i were the yankees i would sure be considering it.

forsberg_us wrote:

Unless there's some risk of the award being more than the Yankees already have to pay A-Rod, I don't see a significant down side to telling him to go pound sand.

I agree with you.  I would like to see it happen.  But I suspect the lawyers would sense a free for all and turn it into a circus. Perhaps he could counter-sue on some grounds, even outside of the framework for breach.  Imagine if he claimed he was subtly coerced to use PEDs by the teams he played for?

That's where I think MLB be could be proactive and simply lay down the law and allow clubs to void contracts of players who are confirmed to have used PEDs.  "Hey, we signed you, with that much money, on the presumption that you were not CHEATING!" Sounds simple to me.

forsberg_us wrote:

Max wrote:

That's where I think MLB be could be proactive and simply lay down the law and allow clubs to void contracts of players who are confirmed to have used PEDs.  "Hey, we signed you, with that much money, on the presumption that you were not CHEATING!" Sounds simple to me.

Not without the union's agreement. 

That's where slectively applied pressure is needed.  

One phenomenon I am increasngly aware of as I grow older, is the skill of individuals in negotiating what they want.  

Max wrote:

forsberg_us wrote:

Max wrote:

That's where I think MLB be could be proactive and simply lay down the law and allow clubs to void contracts of players who are confirmed to have used PEDs.  "Hey, we signed you, with that much money, on the presumption that you were not CHEATING!" Sounds simple to me.

Not without the union's agreement. 

That's where slectively applied pressure is needed.  

One phenomenon I am increasngly aware of as I grow older, is the skill of individuals in negotiating what they want.  

The MLBPA has the longest winning streak since Notre Dame football over Navy. There's no way the players ever agree to management having the option to void contracts.
 

APIAD wrote:

forsberg_us wrote:

Max wrote:

That's where I think MLB be could be proactive and simply lay down the law and allow clubs to void contracts of players who are confirmed to have used PEDs.  "Hey, we signed you, with that much money, on the presumption that you were not CHEATING!" Sounds simple to me.

Not without the union's agreement. 

i assume a lifetime ban woukd void the contract?

Also, why cant team request in the players comtract that a provision be put in about voiding the comtract if the player test positive?  If the player agrees to it then so what.  If the player doesnt agree he probable is a user.
 

No player would ever agree to that. Or, more specifically, no agent would let his client sign a contract with a provision like that. It's sort of like the baseball version of asking someone when he stopped beating his wife.
 

Last edited by artie_fufkin (6/07/2013 9:01 am)