If Obama did it, it must be bad, or so the conservative wisdom goes.  Watch for Glenn Beck to go after Musial.  Knowing Beck he can probably find a way to say on the air that Stan was helping to send Jews off the incinerator, and then get FOX to back him up.

Max wrote:

If Obama did it, it must be bad, or so the conservative wisdom goes.  Watch for Glenn Beck to go after Musial.  Knowing Beck he can probably find a way to say on the air that Stan was helping to send Jews off the incinerator, and then get FOX to back him up.

Sometimes your need to put a political spin on everything becomes a bit tiresome.

BTW, Obama certainly owed it to him after monopolizing the pre-game time at an All-Star game that should have focused entirely on Stan and not some run-of-the-mill Chicago pol.

I'm still trying to figure out the Angela Merkle selection.  Is Obama tying to show he's on board with the anti-diversity movement, so long as it's in Europe?

Last edited by Mags (11/17/2010 10:42 pm)

Mags wrote:

BTW, Obama certainly owed it to him after monopolizing the pre-game time at an All-Star game that should have focused entirely on Stan and not some run-of-the-mill Chicago pol.

I can tell this will be a fun thread.

I'll agree that Max's shot was unnecessary, but this was as far off the mark since All-Star pre-game activities doesn't fall under the authority of the POTUS.

I don't remember the circumstances surrounding what happened last year, but I don't recall anyone outside of St. Louis complaining about Musial's treatment. I know there was hope that the scene would be as good as Williams at Fenway, but there's no chance that will ever happen again. TV time constraints won't allow it.

Mags wrote:

Max wrote:

If Obama did it, it must be bad, or so the conservative wisdom goes.  Watch for Glenn Beck to go after Musial.  Knowing Beck he can probably find a way to say on the air that Stan was helping to send Jews off the incinerator, and then get FOX to back him up.

Sometimes your need to put a political spin on everything becomes a bit tiresome.

BTW, Obama certainly owed it to him after monopolizing the pre-game time at an All-Star game that should have focused entirely on Stan and not some run-of-the-mill Chicago pol.

I'm still trying to figure out the Angela Merkle selection.  Is Obama tying to show he's on board with the anti-diversity movement, so long as it's in Europe?

Hyperbole aside, I will assume that your intent was "Sometimes your need to put a political spin on some things becomes a bit tiresome."

That's probably true, but I thought this was an appropriate situation to point out how conservatives' stated goals to make Obama fail, and their implicit strategy of being against everything he is for, along with their partnering with grade-A mercantilist buffoons who will say any hateful thing if it makes a buck, leaves a lot of collateral damage. What good is a presidential medal when it comes from a "socialist" who "just has a different belief system than most Americans."  Who would accept a medal from such a guy?!?

Last edited by Max (11/18/2010 10:49 am)

tkihshbt wrote:

I don't remember the circumstances surrounding what happened last year, but I don't recall anyone outside of St. Louis complaining about Musial's treatment. I know there was hope that the scene would be as good as Williams at Fenway, but there's no chance that will ever happen again. TV time constraints won't allow it.

I doubt anyone outside of St. Louis really even expect that a all star game in St. Louis should have a pregame based around Stan or would put Stan in the top ten as far as baseball players go.  He is largely forgoten.

Max wrote:

forsberg_us wrote:

Bernie gets it, even if others apparently don't

I saw that and figured someone would post it if I didn't.  In your heart, you probably know that this does not actually mean that baseball transcends politics, but rather that the Rupert Murdochs of this world, henchmen like Roger Ailes, and all their minions, like Beck, see Stan Musial as untouchable, for now.  Do you really think for a minute that they would not be calling on Stan, right now, to tell him not to be tarred by Obama's hand, unless they had done the math and calculated they would lose?

Actually Max, what I know in my heart is that you took a situation that had no political implications whatsoever and turned it into your opportunity to lecture us on your politics.  It was stupid then and your attempts to explain yourself aren't helping your case any.

Max wrote:

forsberg_us wrote:

Max wrote:

I saw that and figured someone would post it if I didn't.  In your heart, you probably know that this does not actually mean that baseball transcends politics, but rather that the Rupert Murdochs of this world, henchmen like Roger Ailes, and all their minions, like Beck, see Stan Musial as untouchable, for now.  Do you really think for a minute that they would not be calling on Stan, right now, to tell him not to be tarred by Obama's hand, unless they had done the math and calculated they would lose?

Actually Max, what I know in my heart is that you took a situation that had no political implications whatsoever and turned it into your opportunity to lecture us on your politics.  It was stupid then and your attempts to explain yourself aren't helping your case any.

If it had no political implications, then why the Bernie piece explaining that "We're a polarized nation in many ways. We dig into our respective corners. Republicans vs. Democrats. Liberals vs. Conservatives. We snarl at each other. We don't seem to agree on much. But we can agree on this: Stan Musial transcends all of that."?

To point out the obvious to people like you.

And weren't there just as many wingnuts who spent the better part of 2005-08 telling us that everything that Bush did/was doing was just as bad?  Didn't Michael Moore, Al Gore, Bill Maher, Keith Olbermann and many others make plenty of money by selling off of the exact same sort of polarizing fear, just from a different perspective?

Yes, I agree that it's a bad thing for people to disagree with everything Obama does on the notion that if he did it, it must be bad.  What I find humorous is that you had so little problem taking that exact same position with the previous president and seem to be so indignant that others are doing the same thing now.  I seem to remember about 3 years of your posts where you (along with Maher, Olbermann, Huffington, Moore, etc...) described the various war crimes/human rights tribunals that would need to be convened after Bush and his administration left office, but now someone is attacking your President and you get all bent about it.

Max,

I don't see a real need or purpose to continuing the debate.  There's plenty of blame on both sides of the political aisles to go around regarding the current state of politics.

Suffice to say I felt your need to inject politics into a thread regarding Musial finally receiving an award after several years of people speculating whether or not he would was ill-timed and in extremely poor taste, regardless of your reasons.

Mags wrote:

forsberg_us wrote:

Max,

I don't see a real need or purpose to continuing the debate.  There's plenty of blame on both sides of the political aisles to go around regarding the current state of politics.

Suffice to say I felt your need to inject politics into a thread regarding Musial finally receiving an award after several years of people speculating whether or not he would was ill-timed and in extremely poor taste, regardless of your reasons.

Thanks, fors.  I decided to sit this one out for the day and not even look in on it for fear I might have a momentary lapse and try to post a response that would certainly not have been as restrained and precise as each of yours has been.  You've put the matter to rest, so as I'm concerned.

About 45 years ago, I worked in a maintenance department and an aluminum plant to their was particular windbag who was always screaming and throwing a fit about lack of support in order to try to get ahead of others in line for service.  My predecessor as dispatcher had moved into another job with less stress because of his series of heart attacks told me one, "Sometimes you just need to say, 'Doc, talk to my ass.  My head hurts.' "

I'm not sure I understand it but somehow it conveys the idea perfectly.  Afterwords, I used that statement about 3 times a week to make it clear that I wasn't interested anything else that pain in the ass might have to say.

I spent some time looking back over the nearly seven years of posts that survive on the New Message Board. Some of my more contentions points were that I argued that the right side won the Civil War, that the Iraq War and the Bush-Cheney propaganda to sell it to us were mistakes, that the Abu Graib affair was a horrible public relations that turned much of the Muslim world against us, that it was a mistake under all circumstances to equate Islam with terrorism, and that a major danger to ourselves is the unresolved issue of racism.  In all that time I don't recall anyone else ever calling me a name.  But if I am to be a pain in the ass, then so be it, because my opinions on those issues haven't changed.

APRTW wrote:

So this thread started about how Stan getting this award wasnt a political statement but then turned into a political thread.

APRTW,

Once again, I have read and reread fors' intial post and I don't think there was a hint about the subject of politics in any shape, form, or fashion.  It seemed to me it was entirely a recognition and celebration of much overdue and still inadequate recognition of one of the very best human beings with whom we've had the good fortune to share this planet

Last edited by Mags (11/19/2010 9:40 pm)

Mags wrote:

APRTW wrote:

So this thread started about how Stan getting this award wasnt a political statement but then turned into a political thread.

APRTW,

Once again, I have read and reread fors' intial post and I don't think there was a hint about the subject of politics in any shape, form, or fashion.  It seemed to me it was entirely a recognition and celebration of much overdue and still inadequate recognition of one of the very best human beings with whom we've had the good fortune to share this planet

Oh I agree that the first post wasnt what ruined this thread.