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APIAD · 7/01/2011 5:51 pm

HOLLIDAY ILL, SET TO DH

ST. PETERSBURG, Fla. -- The plan this evening was to get David Freese a break by putting him at designated hitter, manager Tony La Russa said. That changed when Matt Holliday showed up at the ballpark ill.

Holliday said he's dealing with some aches, pains, and a cold virus-like ailment. He does not have a fever, and he doesn't expect to be sidelined any more by the illness than being stuck at DH tonight.

"Needs a day from playing the field," La Russa said.

The manager said the bullpen is in relative good health, and that includes having long man Brandon Dickson available if tonight's game goes haywire on Jake Westbrook. The only untouchable is Mitchell Boggs, and Fernando Salas would only be available if needed "to win a game," as La Russa said.

***

HOLLIDAY AT DH

ST. PETERSBURG, Fla. -- Matt Holliday gets a "half-day off," as manager Tony La Russa likes to say of the DH assignment, and Mark Hamilton starts at first base tonight as the Cardinals open a three-game series against the Tampa Bay Rays at Tropicana Field.

Lance Berkman and his 35-year-old legs will patrol the artificial turf in right field tonight.

The Cardinals' lineup:

1. Theriot, SS

2. Jay, LF

3. Holliday, DH

4. Berkman, RF

5. Freese, 3B

6. Rasmus, CF

7. Molina, C

8. Hamilton, 1B

9. Schumaker, 2B

(Westbrook, P)

The Rays' lineup:

1. Damon, DH

2. Zobrist, 2B

3. Longoria, 3B

4. Joyce, RF

5. Upton, CF

6. Kotchman, 1B

7. Jaso, 2B

8. Fuld, LF

9. Brignac, SS

(Davis P)

tkihshbt · 7/01/2011 8:17 pm

Dewon Brazelton might have to pitch the ninth inning for Tampa Bay.

Webstergrovesalum · 7/01/2011 8:20 pm

tkihshbt wrote:
Dewon Brazelton might have to pitch the ninth inning for Tampa Bay.

That hissy-fit from that Tampa Bay pitcher was a classic! Too funny!
(grin) (lol)

Max · 7/01/2011 8:34 pm

I'm about ready for a hissy fit after that appearance by Lance Franklin.

My first chance to watch him, and I was thinking, "this guy could be good if he could stop nibbling and locate his pitches". Then he stopped nibbling and balls started to go a really long way.

Max · 7/01/2011 8:36 pm

Watching the replay. I do believe Rasmus admired his hit and gave a little bat flip, Jr., as he chewed his gum non-chalantly.

Webstergrovesalum · 7/01/2011 8:41 pm

Max wrote:
Watching the replay. I do believe Rasmus admired his hit and gave a little bat flip, Jr., as he chewed his gum non-chalantly.

So you're saying Rasmus caused the Hissy-fit? Ok - maybe it was a tad bit "in your face" but pitchers might need to have a little bit more control than that!

Max · 7/01/2011 8:42 pm

I've been away so long I must have missed the news that the Rays hired Hammurabi to be their manager.

artie_fufkin · 7/01/2011 9:03 pm

Max wrote:
I'm about ready for a hissy fit after that appearance by Lance Franklin.

My first chance to watch him, and I was thinking, "this guy could be good if he could stop nibbling and locate his pitches". Then he stopped nibbling and balls started to go a really long way.

I think I read Duncan's lips during the conference on the mound: "You're pitching exactly the way the guy we cut to make room for you used to pitch."

artie_fufkin · 7/01/2011 9:10 pm

Webstergrovesalum wrote:
Max wrote:
Watching the replay. I do believe Rasmus admired his hit and gave a little bat flip, Jr., as he chewed his gum non-chalantly.
So you're saying Rasmus caused the Hissy-fit? Ok - maybe it was a tad bit "in your face" but pitchers might need to have a little bit more control than that!

He's kidding, Web. Max is trying to acknowledge that some of his criticisms of Rasmus earlier in the week may have been ill-timed.

artie_fufkin · 7/01/2011 9:15 pm

Max wrote:
I've been away so long I must have missed the news that the Rays hired Hammurabi to be their manager.

Hammurabi is the bench coach, I believe. The manager is Andy Warhol's twin brother.

Webstergrovesalum · 7/01/2011 9:15 pm

artie_fufkin wrote:
Webstergrovesalum wrote:
Max wrote:
Watching the replay. I do believe Rasmus admired his hit and gave a little bat flip, Jr., as he chewed his gum non-chalantly.
So you're saying Rasmus caused the Hissy-fit? Ok - maybe it was a tad bit "in your face" but pitchers might need to have a little bit more control than that!
He's kidding, Web. Max is trying to acknowledge that some of his criticisms of Rasmus earlier in the week may have been ill-timed.

(shocked) Still laughing at that "hissy-fit" anyway (lol) I mean, really, how many times do we see a grown man, (a major league pitcher), throw his mitt down in a fit & then try to spike a baseball, only to have words with an umpire who proceeds to throw him out during said fit! Then he loses it even more? Still laughing about that one.

Webstergrovesalum · 7/01/2011 9:26 pm

I'm starting to understand the Ray's melt-down a little more now. Their coach got thrown out after arguing a walk. Then there was a balk called ---- then another walk--- then the 3 run HR. Recipe for melt-down I suppose (cute)

forsberg_us · 7/01/2011 9:34 pm

I didn't see the game, but was listening to it on the radio--our announcers early and the Rays announcers later. The sense I had was that the home plate umpire wasn't having a good night. In fact, in the 9th, the Tampa announcers were so sarcastic, it was difficult to actually tell what was happening.

We were at dinner during the melt down. I could see about half the TV screen in a mirror. I can't wait to see the replay. It sounds epic.

artie_fufkin · 7/01/2011 9:45 pm

Webstergrovesalum wrote:
I'm starting to understand the Ray's melt-down a little more now. Their coach got thrown out after arguing a walk. Then there was a balk called ---- then another walk--- then the 3 run HR. Recipe for melt-down I suppose (cute)

The problem is the umpires were right and the Rays were wrong. In every instance. Just because the pitcher hits the mitt doesn't mean the pitch is a strike. Jaso was set up well inside on the 3-2 pitch to Berkman, and it was a ball. Close, but a ball, and it was confirmed on the replay as a ball. Rays' TV didn't show the replay of the disputed pitch to Freese, but it was the same pitch the umpire called a ball to Berkman.
The balk was indisputable. Howell flinched, and both the plate umpire and the first base umpire saw it. As soon as I saw it, I reflexively said to my son "That's a balk." I don't think that played any part of Howell's meltdown. He was pissed about not getting the close pittches.
Maddon was just trying to wake up his team. He knows he can't argue balls and strikes. And it worked, to a degree.
As for Howell slamming his glove to the ground, if one of my Little League kids had done that, I would have taken him off the field, sat him on the bench for the rest of the game and after it was over made him apologize to the umpire, his teammates, and the kids on the other team.

artie_fufkin · 7/01/2011 9:58 pm

forsberg_us wrote:
I didn't see the game, but was listening to it on the radio--our announcers early and the Rays announcers later. The sense I had was that the home plate umpire wasn't having a good night. In fact, in the 9th, the Tampa announcers were so sarcastic, it was difficult to actually tell what was happening.

We were at dinner during the melt down. I could see about half the TV screen in a mirror. I can't wait to see the replay. It sounds epic.

If the Rays have a beef with the plate ump, it's because he was giving Westbrook the bottom of the zone, which played into Westbrook's strength as a sinker ball pitcher. But he was consistent. And the replays consistently backed him up.
Howell didn't melt down until after Rasmus hit a ball about 20 rows into the seats. Best I can recall, it wasn't the plate umpire who threw the pitch.

forsberg_us · 7/01/2011 10:14 pm

We came out of the restaurant in the top of the 9th. I was listening to the Rays feed and it went something like:

Announcer 1- Pitch to Theriot. Well I think it was a ball. I mean I think it was called a ball, but that pitch was a strike for the first 6 inning of the game.

Announcer 2- Are you sure it wasn't a strike? I mean, the ump called so many strikes and threw out so many Rays, are we sure he just can't move his shoulder? It may be tired or even injured.

Announcer 1- We'll just have to wait and see. If Theriot walks, we'll know it was a ball; if he strikes out, we'll know it was a strike; and if Theriot puts it in play it'll just have to be a mystery.

artie_fufkin · 7/01/2011 10:47 pm

From the St. Petersburg Times:

"He took it personal," Howell said of Carapazza. "If he can't take it, we're supposed to take it, but he can't take it. I know nobody ever cheers for them and they always get yelled at, and I know that must be frustrating. But the pitches I made, if I can make those pitches, you make a lot of money doing that, and you deserve that call. Especially when you do it twice to two great hitters. That's messing with people's careers, and that's why emotions fly. That's not right."

Interesting. Not "I got squeezed and it cost our team a game when we're fighting to keep pace with the Yankees and the Red Sox," but "Hey, this might affect my bank account ..."

forsberg_us · 7/01/2011 11:14 pm

Not only that, but note he never said the pitches were strikes. He simply said that he made the pitches he wanted to make and "deserved" the calls.

I also would have loved for a reporter to have asked Howell how pitches like the one he threw to Rasmus affect a pitcher's salary/career.

BTW, finally saw the meltdown. Friggin classic. It never gets old watching someone slam his glove on the ground. Brings back fond memories of Pedro Guerrero and Ted Lilly.

Last edited by forsberg_us (7/01/2011 11:18 pm)

tkihshbt · 7/01/2011 11:41 pm

Brewers lose. Cardinals take sole possession of first place.

Max · 7/02/2011 2:47 am

Webstergrovesalum wrote:
Max wrote:
Watching the replay. I do believe Rasmus admired his hit and gave a little bat flip, Jr., as he chewed his gum non-chalantly.
So you're saying Rasmus caused the Hissy-fit? Ok - maybe it was a tad bit "in your face" but pitchers might need to have a little bit more control than that!

Oh no. That's not what I meant at all. I think the home plate ump caused the hissy fit. The pitch to Rasmus was so ripe, Rasmus is lucky he didn't do the bat flip before hitting the home run. There was no doubt about that one. But I think that of we could have read Howell's mind at that point he would have been saying something like, "Are you happy now?!? You call anything off the center of the plate a ball and the only option I have left is to throw the ball over the heart of plate.

Max · 7/02/2011 2:48 am

artie_fufkin wrote:
Webstergrovesalum wrote:
Max wrote:
Watching the replay. I do believe Rasmus admired his hit and gave a little bat flip, Jr., as he chewed his gum non-chalantly.
So you're saying Rasmus caused the Hissy-fit? Ok - maybe it was a tad bit "in your face" but pitchers might need to have a little bit more control than that!
He's kidding, Web. Max is trying to acknowledge that some of his criticisms of Rasmus earlier in the week may have been ill-timed.

Well, not exactly that, either. I know we got on Pujols's case earlier in the year after he pulled a Bonds, and admired his home run and flipped the bat after hitting a walk off. Rasmus wasn't quite that obvious, but there was some self-admiration there. Just an observation.

Max · 7/02/2011 2:55 am

forsberg_us wrote:
Not only that, but note he never said the pitches were strikes. He simply said that he made the pitches he wanted to make and "deserved" the calls.

i noticed that, too. i can't say as I was watching closely enough to say whether they were balls or not, as Artie did--insanely jet-lagged, then still had to stay up until 4 am writing a report. but this whole business of 'i deserved those calls' is bullshit. and it's just too mercenary for my taste to discuss how it affects his bank account. why not just agree to give the umps a cut of any pay raise he gets if they agree to call strikes that are off the plate, as long as he can do it twice against two great hitters?

Webstergrovesalum · 7/02/2011 8:49 am

forsberg_us wrote:
Not only that, but note he never said the pitches were strikes. He simply said that he made the pitches he wanted to make and "deserved" the calls.

I also would have loved for a reporter to have asked Howell how pitches like the one he threw to Rasmus affect a pitcher's salary/career.

BTW, finally saw the meltdown. Friggin classic. It never gets old watching someone slam his glove on the ground. Brings back fond memories of Pedro Guerrero and Ted Lilly.

I guess Rasmus hadn't even finished rounding the bases as all this was going on too! (lol)

forsberg_us · 7/02/2011 10:51 am

Berkman sums it up well:

"He walked two guys and gave up a three-run homer and then threw a tantrum on the field. That's basically what happened. They're nice (pitches). They're competitive pitches. But they're not strikes."

http://www.stltoday.com/sports/baseball/professional/article_967b7b7b-fb04-5eb5-9a20-b64be3623b73.html

artie_fufkin · 7/02/2011 11:24 am

Max wrote:
artie_fufkin wrote:
Webstergrovesalum wrote:

So you're saying Rasmus caused the Hissy-fit? Ok - maybe it was a tad bit "in your face" but pitchers might need to have a little bit more control than that!
He's kidding, Web. Max is trying to acknowledge that some of his criticisms of Rasmus earlier in the week may have been ill-timed.
Well, not exactly that, either. I know we got on Pujols's case earlier in the year after he pulled a Bonds, and admired his home run and flipped the bat after hitting a walk off. Rasmus wasn't quite that obvious, but there was some self-admiration there. Just an observation.

Jeez, Max. If the thing you took away from all that nonsense was Rasmus allegedly showing up the other team, I'd say your fixation is starting to get a little weird.

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