Ball four was a strike on K-Zone.  I am not sure how to bring the graphic up or I would.

From the umpires view, the first pitch was a 4 seam fastball and the second a 2 seamer, both outside the zone here . The Fx system is not perfect , probably none of them are .

http://pitchfx.texasleaguers.com/batter/425877/?pitchers=A&pitches=AA&from=10/28/2011&to=10/28/2011


one called ball was well within the zone .

Last edited by don.rob11 (10/29/2011 7:49 pm)

It shows consecutive pitches to Yadi low, and barely outside the strike zone .

The green square closest to the zone was called ball 4, in which both Feldman and Napoli thought should have been a strike, and they have an argument, many umpires routinely call those strikes , but they didn't get the call on this night . The human factor ......

Last edited by don.rob11 (10/29/2011 9:31 pm)

APRTW wrote:

However there is something to be said for letting a team beat themselfs and not bailing pitchers out by rolling over on a bad pitch.

It was around that time that I posted on my facebook that Texas deserved credit for beating two teams: beating the Cardinals, and beating themselves even worse.  For me, that inning was when the wheels came off for Texas.  After that inning I was breathing easier than during game 3.

The problem with saying that Furcal is the priority from that bunch is that he's also the most expensive by far.  I was criticized for saying that DeWitt should take note: he raised payroll and won, and the criticism was more or less that all the payroll increase did was pay to keep guys we already had and add Berkman, and then a few more guys in July.  This is always going to be the case, but it doesn't mean that the owners are going to pony up for all the raises and add an all-star and a bunch of pieces in July.  Sometimes, if necessary, they'll even trade away something useful but expensive, just to get costs back within the budget.

So, I think you tell Theriot and Rhodes thank you very much, shake their hand, and wish them well on their way out the door.  With Furcal, Skip, and Dotel, it will come down to what we want to offer versus what someone else wants to offer.  At the moment, Jay does little to nothing that Skip doesn't do better, but more expensively.  Depends on AAV and years.  Other teams will be interested in Furcal, but oddly he doesn't bring a lot that Ryan didn't do as well or better for a lot less money.  Maybe Seattle will send him back to us?  My hunch is that Dotel would be nice, but we don't really need him much.  LHP will be more important for a la russa bullpen.

Closer: Motte
RH Set up: Salas, Lynn
LH Set up: Zep, . . . ?

Others: Sanchez, Kmac, Boggs

tkihshbt wrote:

I think they'll make Furcal a priority, and I can't imagine that Punto isn't the starting second baseman next season. La Russa learned a valuable lesson.

Re: Skip -- he's a TLR favorite, but are the Cardinals going to give him a raise to be a utility player? I wouldn't be surprised if they keep him around to put pressure on Jon Jay.

Furcal might be a priority but I dont think he is that impressive.  Dont get me wrong I think he is the best option.  He passes the eye test better then Theriot.  However Furcal only hit .255 as a Cardinal.  He also committed 10 errors in 422 innings compared to Theriot's 17 in 755.  Plus he had a really shitty postseason at the plate.  I wouldnt over pay to get him.

APRTW wrote:

tkihshbt wrote:

Furcal is 34 and has played 170 games the past two seasons. I'd be pretty surprised if teams are banging down his door to give him a bunch of money.

As for Dotel, he's automatic against right-handed batters and provides the most experience out of the pen. Sanchez is an unknown and they hate Boggs. He's going to cost $2.75 million. Just bring him back.

I agree if they can get Dotel for under 3 million.  What do you think Furcal is worth.  I was thinking 6-10.  I now think I wasover valueing him by abou double his worth.  I would say  3-5 is about right.

The Cardinals hold an option on Dotel for $3.5M.  If they don't, they have to pay him a buy out of $0.75M, so I suspect that's where Tk got the $2.75M.  IMO, they are crazy not to bring him back.  He was the nuts against RH, and he has more than 100 career saves.  He offers insurance in case Motte, Salas or whoever else they try falter, and it probably isn't a bad thing to have an experienced Latin American pitcher to mentor Sanchez.

I agree with Tk, I doubt there will be a rush to sign Furcal.  It's a good year for shortstops with Reyes and Rollins headlining the free agent class.  I doubt he gets more than a one year with a low base and incentives.  Maybe a vesting option for a second year based on plate appearances.

FYI- for those of you not in St. Louis.  Fox Sports Midwest's website is streaming the parade.  It started about a half hour ago, but they haven't made it to the stadium yet.

http://www.foxsportsmidwest.com/

Last edited by forsberg_us (10/30/2011 4:36 pm)

BTW: I don't recall anyone mentioning it, but I think Craig has officially put to rest for all time the opinion that there was no position for him on defense with that over the wall catch of Cruz's attempted home run in the 6th.  I'm guessing that Holliday doesn't make that catch.

The first order of business is obviously Albert. Everything else comes after.
I don't want to be the turd in the punch bowl, but signing Albert from strictly a business perspective is still a bad idea.
Otherwise, the Cardinals are in pretty good shape. The starting rotation is set, and no matter what a lineup that already includes Holliday, Berkman, Freese, Jay, Molina and Craig is formidable.
I've been hearing some rumblings the last two days that Tone might hang 'em up, since he's really got nothing left to prove. He'll end up somewhere. I think he really want sto read the phrase "second winningest manager ever" on his HofF plaque.

forsberg_us wrote:

"I don't want to be the turd in the punch bowl, but signing Albert from strictly a business perspective is still a bad idea."

Meaning?  You think signing Pujols would be a mistake because of the effect on payroll or you think that it's a bad idea for the owners to analyze it as a business decision?

The Yankees can give Jeter $18 million or whatever a year to maintain his legacy and make sure he gets a monument. If DeWitt is looking strictly at the bottom line, he won't make the same accommodation for Pujols. Assuming for the sake of simplicity Albert wants $300 million for 10 years, the Cardinals won't pay Albert $30 million when he's 41-years-old. It's bad business, and DeWitt isn't a bad businessman.
Personally, I'd love to see Albert finish his career as a Cardinal, as they continue to compete for championships. I don't care about the business end. I want to take my grandson or granddaughter to St. Louis about 25 years from now, point at Albert's statue and say "He's the best baseball player I ever saw ..."
I guess the best thing we can hope for in the immediate future is the Cardinals use these next five days or so before free agency starts to engage in serious negotiations.

I really don't know why La Russa would come back. He guided the Cardinals to two improbable championships and that's one more than Whitey. He has nothing left to prove and I can't imagine going through the rigors of another season at 67.

artie_fufkin wrote:

The first order of business is obviously Albert. Everything else comes after.
I don't want to be the turd in the punch bowl, but signing Albert from strictly a business perspective is still a bad idea.
Otherwise, the Cardinals are in pretty good shape. The starting rotation is set, and no matter what a lineup that already includes Holliday, Berkman, Freese, Jay, Molina and Craig is formidable.
I've been hearing some rumblings the last two days that Tone might hang 'em up, since he's really got nothing left to prove. He'll end up somewhere. I think he really want sto read the phrase "second winningest manager ever" on his HofF plaque.

I thought this as well.  My guess is he sits out next year and land in a front office job the following year.