Mozeliak just indicated the team will not likely bring back Lohse to fill Carpenter's spot.  Mozeliak's exact words, "we're comfortable with what we have."  Guess that doesn't entirely rule out the possibility.

Well, time to find out what the young kids are made of.  Have to assume Lynn definitely has a spot in the rotation with Miller, Rosenthal and Kelly competing for the 5th spot.

Last edited by forsberg_us (2/05/2013 2:41 pm)

"I am not excited about 2013." 

Depends on your perspective AP.  Do I think this team makes the playoffs?  No.  I'm not sure they would have made it with Carpenter, but whatever hope they had was reduced.

But, am I excited to see what Miller, Rosenthal and/or Kelly might do with their opportunity?  Yes.  We've been hearing about Miller for a few years.  Rosenthal emerged recently.  There may be some growing pains, but we also could be watching the development of a very good young pitching staff.

At least we aren't going to have to watch Cement-head or Todd Wellemeyer or Adam Ottavino.

This is going to ruin my whole day. Maybe even the rest of the week.

APIAD wrote:

so Carp is retiring or going on the DL.  Either way I assume his 13 million is going to be considered a gift to him?  The Cardinals dont now have that money to spend?

I would assume given his history the Cardinals took out a pretty stringent insurance policy. Memolo and Hollinsworth were on the XM this morning speculating Carp's absence puts Lohse back in play for the Cardinals.
 

I doubt Carpenter will retire immediately.  If he did, he'd be forfeiting his salary for this year.  My guess is he'll be placed on the 60 day DL for 2013 and retire after the season.

I don't know who Memolo and Hollinsworth are, but locally, all indications at this time is that they have no inclination to go after Lohse. This quote is from Strauss' article:

“If we looked before at eight guys for five spots, now it’s seven for five spots,” Mozeliak said.

Underlying the issue of signing Lohse is that it would likely push payroll to $125M, which is probably unlikely.

artie_fufkin wrote:

“If we looked before at eight guys for five spots, now it’s seven for five spots,” Mozeliak said.

The numbers are accurate, but of those seven, three have been in the major leagues for less than a year, one has a shoulder that could blow out if he sneezes too hard, another one has yet to prove he's fully-reverted to pre-Teej form, another ran out of gas and became so ineffective he had to be sent to the bullpen in the middle of a pennant race, and the other is Jake Freakin' Westbrook.
I'm always wary of the "We'll have enough pitching" mentality. No team since the 1970 Orioles has really been able to say that with certainty.

My sentiments exactly.

How did this board decide overnight that the Cardinals couldnt make the playoffs?  i think for the right price Loshe would be perfect for the Cardinals.  If you could get him for 3/21 -3/30 why wouldnt you.  i am sure that isnt the current market value and Boras would buckle a tthe idea but what does it hurt to throw it out there. 

APIAD wrote:

How did this board decide overnight that the Cardinals couldnt make the playoffs?  

Well, that's been my position for awhile now. People might disagree, but it's what I'm seeing.
 

tkihshbt wrote:

My guess is that, internally, the Cardinals view 2013 pessimistically. Bringing back Kyle Lohse and expecting him to repeat 2012 is a pretty big reach. And even if he did, it wouldn't be enough to get them within even the second wild card. Frankly, I'd rather them not pay lip service to reaching the playoffs and spare the huge cost it would take to bring in Lohse for a doomed run, and instead find out what they have with Miller and Rosenthal.  

I think you nailed it Tk.  Lohse improves the team, but doesn't push it over the top.  Not only is it unlikely Lohse repeats 16-3, it's unlikely Lynn repeats 18-7.  Wainwright may be improved, but I suspect there's a degree of regression on its way.

2013 will be about preparing for 2014 and beyond.  Hopefully Wainwright reasserts himself as a front of the rotation starter (and they get him signed to an extension), Lynn shows up in shape and ready to cross the 200 innings threshold and either Miller or Rosenthal can get somewhere in the 180 inning range.  Westbrook is simply a placeholder, and with the uncertainty of Garcia's shoulder, my guess is there's another 100 innings as a starter for either Kelly or whoever doesn't win the 5th starter job.

 

I think an average year from Loshe would push this team to the brink of making the playoffs.  Who knows how this didivsion is going to shake out.  Brewers might lose Braun to roids again.  I doubt it but it could happen and the Reds could shit themselfs again.  I dont even know if they have a thrid baseman. 

I wouldnt spend alot on Loshe but Id signing for within the range I suggested.  It is almost mid feb.  I dont know that Loshe value can be judged that this point.  Id just throw it out there.  who know, maybe the Cardinals have and got shut down.

IDk what the pitchers you named will go for but I am not interested in the Cardinals spending 20 million a year on a pitcher.  Wainwright being the exception and that is to keep him in STL.  Not because I think he is worth that much.

Oh yeah, I was reading about Rolen debating on playing again. 

IDK what the Cardinals chances are on the division.  I really dont.  I dont think they are going to be horrible.  I know most of the player are going to decline but the Cardinals lost alot of games in 2012 that they shouldnt have.  If that changes maybe they can offset the decline.

APIAD wrote:

How did this board decide overnight that the Cardinals couldnt make the playoffs?  i think for the right price Loshe would be perfect for the Cardinals.  If you could get him for 3/21 -3/30 why wouldnt you.  i am sure that isnt the current market value and Boras would buckle a tthe idea but what does it hurt to throw it out there. 

I'm not dismissing anything, AP.I didn't expect them to back up the Brink's truck in Zack Greinke's driveway. I just think it's overly optimistic for a second place team to add only Randy Choate to a pitching staff and then announce "Bring it on."