APIAD wrote:

how does it effect teams like the indians who just lost a pick if they sign loshe?  do they lose another?

I think they lose their next available pick, so for Cleveland it would cost them a 3rd round pick.  At least I think that's how it works.

I can't imagine they'd sign Lohse at this point.  They spent real money to sign Swisher and Bourn.  They're probably already $15-20M over last year's payroll.  They could use the pitching, but it would be a pretty significant change in their recent approach to payroll.

APIAD wrote:

just brainstorming but for teams who already signed a free agent with draft comp it actually gets cheaper to sign more.  also if a team signs loshe to a one year deal and offer him a qualifing offer during the following offseason they basicly get there pick back when he signs with another team.  

Unless he accepts the tender.

I think it will be interesting going forward to see who gets tendered.  At the time the Cardinals tendered Lohse, it seemed like a no-brainer because everyone assumed he'd get a multiple year offer.  Knowing what we now know about how the draft pick compensation drags down value, the Cardinals might not have offered it out of fear Lohse would have accepted it.  The tender was $13.3M.

Last edited by forsberg_us (2/12/2013 2:14 pm)

APIAD wrote:

on the flip side having loshe for one year at that price wouldnt be such a bad deal for the cardinals.  i hope it gives the current teams more power to retain average players and there is less turnover and bad contracts.

Fair point, but if I'm Boras, and especially if I'm Lohse, I'm balking at being called "average." He's coming off a year when he was the opening day pitcher, went 16-3 with an ERA under 3.00 and a WHIP slightly over 1.00, and then got handed the ball four times in the playoffs. His 2011 and 2007 seasons were solid, and you could make a case in between he's owed a Mulligan because of that spooky arm problem.
I know no one with eyeballs is ever going to confuse Kyle Lohse with Justin Verlander, but pitchers with lesser numbers than Lohse got huge contracts under the old free agency rules. Lohse has every right to bitch that he's getting screwed.
 

Day 108

I really, really hope Lohse doesn't pay attention to Rotoworld.  If you click on Kyle Lohse, the first 3 entries that come up under the heading news are:

"Rizzo: Nats not interested in Lohse."

"Report: Indians won't sign Lohse."

"Cards not expected to add starting pitcher."

Oh, I definitely agree with you, Artie, I guess I'm just surprised that someone with as much experience as Lohse is caught off guard by this business. 

boras is the reason loshe isnt signed.  it isnt like he couldnt have signed.  he is trying to get as much as he can.  we will see if boras is right or wrong.  

tkihshbt wrote:

forsberg_us wrote:

At the very least, the MLBPA clearly misjudged the effect of the new rules.  I'm pretty sure they thought they were creating a system that made it easier for players to move to new teams, not the other way around.

I agree. Basically this is a consequence of giving in to MLB on signing bonuses for draftees. The PA sold these guys out so that, theoretically, more money would flow into the coffers of established players. But as we've seen so far, it doesn't work like that. 

There is too much interference in the market and the interference has been a result of too many terrible owners like Jeffrey Loria. 

I didn't post a link at the time, but a few days ago Yahoo ran a photo of the "line" outside Marlins Park when single-game tickets went on sale. There were four people in it.
Loria has now ruined baseball in two cities, one of which he should have been able to sell tickets in by just turning on the electricity. He's swindled Dade County out of hundreds of millions of dollars for his grotesque new stadium, pocketed revenue sharing money and flat out lied to players. And this season he's going to put Mike Stanton around a glorified Triple A team that will lose 100 games.
But, hey, there's a tradeoff. He's brought dancing girls in bikini tops and thongs to the sport.
How Loria and Samson aren't in jail yet is unlikely. How both of them are still in baseball is astonishing.

artie_fufkin wrote:

tkihshbt wrote:

forsberg_us wrote:

At the very least, the MLBPA clearly misjudged the effect of the new rules.  I'm pretty sure they thought they were creating a system that made it easier for players to move to new teams, not the other way around.

I agree. Basically this is a consequence of giving in to MLB on signing bonuses for draftees. The PA sold these guys out so that, theoretically, more money would flow into the coffers of established players. But as we've seen so far, it doesn't work like that. 

There is too much interference in the market and the interference has been a result of too many terrible owners like Jeffrey Loria. 

I didn't post a link at the time, but a few days ago Yahoo ran a photo of the "line" outside Marlins Park when single-game tickets went on sale. There were four people in it.
Loria has now ruined baseball in two cities, one of which he should have been able to sell tickets in by just turning on the electricity. He's swindled Dade County out of hundreds of millions of dollars for his grotesque new stadium, pocketed revenue sharing money and flat out lied to players. And this season he's going to put Mike Stanton around a glorified Triple A team that will lose 100 games.
But, hey, there's a tradeoff. He's brought dancing girls in bikini tops and thongs to the sport.
How Loria and Samson aren't in jail yet is unlikely. How both of them are still in baseball is astonishing.

Yeah, it really is. MLB really, really messed this one up. 
 

tkihshbt wrote:

artie_fufkin wrote:

tkihshbt wrote:

I agree. Basically this is a consequence of giving in to MLB on signing bonuses for draftees. The PA sold these guys out so that, theoretically, more money would flow into the coffers of established players. But as we've seen so far, it doesn't work like that. 

There is too much interference in the market and the interference has been a result of too many terrible owners like Jeffrey Loria. 

I didn't post a link at the time, but a few days ago Yahoo ran a photo of the "line" outside Marlins Park when single-game tickets went on sale. There were four people in it.
Loria has now ruined baseball in two cities, one of which he should have been able to sell tickets in by just turning on the electricity. He's swindled Dade County out of hundreds of millions of dollars for his grotesque new stadium, pocketed revenue sharing money and flat out lied to players. And this season he's going to put Mike Stanton around a glorified Triple A team that will lose 100 games.
But, hey, there's a tradeoff. He's brought dancing girls in bikini tops and thongs to the sport.
How Loria and Samson aren't in jail yet is unlikely. How both of them are still in baseball is astonishing.

Yeah, it really is. MLB really, really messed this one up. 
 

 
At some point, it's on Selig. Loria's like a drug addicted relative who keeps stealing your stuff to pay for his habit. Sooner or later, you either have to kick him out, call the cops or at least lock up your shit, because he's never going to change.

tkihshbt wrote:

forsberg_us wrote:

Day 109 

Lohse must be paying attention to Rotoworld. In an effort to make him feel better, today's headline reads "Kyle Lohse 'almost certain' to sign deal soon."  Of course he isn't linked to any specific team.
 
It sounds like something the weatherman would say.  "It will be extremely dry today, unless it rains."

I saw that and thought the same thing. I mean, I'm sure he will sign soon, but did you wonder if Rosenthal's source was Scott Boras himself?

 That's exactly what I thought.

Day 113.

Who had Lohse as a free agent on President's Day? 

I had forgotten that the Cardinals didn't sign him until March 13 in 2008, so this isn't unprecedented for him. My guess is this goes one of two ways:

1. He signs a two-year deal for $20 million with the Nationals in March

2. He and Boras ride out most of Spring Training waiting to see if someone goes down for a contending team

Either way, I'm guessing he takes a pay cut. 

Over the weekend, I read - maybe in the P-D - that Garcia claims his shoulder is healthy, but I really don't put too much stock in what I read the first week or two of tranining camp. The players and team are going to put a positive spin on everything, and the writers are so happy to be away from the lousy weather that they'll believe it.
Garcia's first couple of ST outings will be telling.

any news on loshe?