I agree.  I think most people not elected or appointed do not have tolorance for the crime and understand that a cop that work this area for 6 years likely relied on his training to decide when deadly was needed.

Say for a brief second that big mike wasnt shot running away or with his hands up.  Say there was a struggle in the car.  Say the cop didnt put himself at a HUGE disadvantage and pull a much larger man into his squad car window.  Assume that mike was the aggressor in that area.  Then assume that the officer exited his car to attepmt to take into custody the man who assulted him.  Say big mike came at the officer like he did the store owner.  If you were the officer about to be assaulted by a man 2x ur size what do you think you would have done?  I have no clue if that is what happend.  None, but say it did.  Put urself in that situation.

So what does Mr. Levin and Mr. Nolan suggest they do.?  Perhaps they can go to Fergeson and offer their ideas for restoring calm .......

Except they havent developed any sort of warrior mentality and now the actually military has been called.  With all the crazyness i dont believe the cameras have caught a single thing to complain about in relation to police response. Other then the tear gas which imo is the least amount of force they could have used.   Clearly the police have not been allowed to display enough warrior mentality if the military has to be called To show some sort of authority.    This is just another excuse as to why these people are acting like this. 

-----------
"On Friday, several protesters assaulted the officer while he attempted to make an arrest, said Officer Johnna Watson, an Oakland police spokeswoman. The injured officer was taken to a local hospital and later released.At least two other officers were pepper-sprayed and treated at the scene, "


"As nightfall approached, a few protesters with covered faces pulled out paint cans and hammers and sprayed anti-police graffiti on buildings as the march continued along a main Oakland thoroughfare into the neighboring city of Berkeley.Oakland police later arrested two men in their 40s, one for assaulting an officer and the other for obstructing and resisting police, Watson said."

"Instead of making this about racism, if we want to turn this into a "Our government doesn't work, let's start over" movement"

I don't know how the racial element can be ignored. You've got a community that's two-thirds African-American and a police department that's about 90 percent white. 

"I'd feel much better being part of "Midwest USA". Artie can be part of the Northeast, New York/Texas/California and Florida can be their own countries, and the more rural states can actually have national governments that work for them!"

I think it's great idea. But what are all the southern states going to do without the federal funding they get from the government they so despise?

http://wallethub.com/edu/states-most-least-dependent-on-the-federal-government/2700/#main-findings

artie_fufkin wrote:

don.rob11 wrote:

So what does Mr. Levin and Mr. Nolan suggest they do.?  Perhaps they can go to Fergeson and offer their ideas for restoring calm .......

I would think Levin and Nolan probably would have suggested long ago that the demographic of the police department should have more resembled the demographic of the community as a whole, but that's putting words in their mouths.


 

Doesnt excuse the actions of the criminals looting and burning the town.
 

APIAD wrote:

artie_fufkin wrote:

don.rob11 wrote:

So what does Mr. Levin and Mr. Nolan suggest they do.?  Perhaps they can go to Fergeson and offer their ideas for restoring calm .......

I would think Levin and Nolan probably would have suggested long ago that the demographic of the police department should have more resembled the demographic of the community as a whole, but that's putting words in their mouths.


 

Doesnt excuse the actions of the criminals looting and burning the town.
 

No, it doesn't. But when you're called "fucking animals" by a representative of law enforcement who appears to have no real understanding of the community in which you live and doesn't understand the anger you feel when a person who is walking down the street gets told to "get on the fucking sidewalk" by a cop who leaves town as soon as his shift is over and then shoots the guy six times, there's going to be rage, and there aren't a lot of alternatives when police are firing rubber bullets and tear gas at you.
 

artie_fufkin wrote:

don.rob11 wrote:

So what does Mr. Levin and Mr. Nolan suggest they do.?  Perhaps they can go to Fergeson and offer their ideas for restoring calm .......

I would think Levin and Nolan probably would have suggested long ago that the demographic of the police department should have more resembled the demographic of the community as a whole, but that's putting words in their mouths.


 

That's a solution that's much easier said than done.  The number of qualified black cops is limited, and because of the push for diversification all over the county, a small municipality like Ferguson has two choices: hire white cops or accept much less qualified black candidates.

Back when I worked at U.City, we went through almost the exact same process.  U. City is about 50-50 black/white.  Initially, the black officers we hired were top-notch guys.  Problem was, they'd get a couple of years experience with us and move on to a better opportunity.  When it became obvious we couldn't retain the quality black candidates, we lowered the standards.  Shortly thereafter, we hired a black guy with a juvenile conviction for attempted rape (in U. City nonetheless) who ended up unable to work in the west end of town because his wife's restraining order prohibited him from being within a certain distance of her while armed, and the City didn't want to risk having to send him to a call near their house.  He was later fired when the department learned he was stalking a female crime victim.  We hired another black officer who had recently been fired from Kinloch (picture the worst department in St. Louis County).  At the time he was hired, he weighed about 400 pounds.  He was fired after warrants were issued for his arrest for kidnapping and rape of his baby's mama.  Then there was the black female officer we hired who got canned for firing a shot at a motorist in the middle of the Delmar Loop on a Saturday afternoon (picture the busiest business district in town, with tons of outdoor dining and pedestrian traffic) because the motorist had the temerity to drive off with her pen after she dropped it in his car after she wrote him a ticket.

U. City is much larger than Ferguson and has a much higher tax base, so it pays its officers much better than does Ferguson.  As much as U. City struggled to hire qualified black officers, I can only imagine was a town like Ferguson would go through. 

Radio caller says Brown rushed officer
http://www.ky3.com/news/nation/autopsy-michael-brown-shot-at-least-6-times/21049024_27577754

don.rob11 wrote:

Radio caller says Brown rushed officer
http://www.ky3.com/news/nation/autopsy-michael-brown-shot-at-least-6-times/21049024_27577754

There's also this video shot by someone in the neighborhood.  I wouldn't recommend listening at work because the language is coarse, but when you listen, skip ahead to about the 6:40 mark.  Listen to the guy speaking in the background.  He very clearly says that Brown doubled back toward the cop and that's when the officer started shooting (which would be consistent with the autopsy report).  Funny this witness hasn't been interviewed on national TV.  My guess, he isn't speaking to law enforcement (at least not voluntarily).

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/08/18/youtube-video-captures-purported-witness-backing-police-version-in-ferguson/ 

If Brown assaulted the officer once, and went for his gun in the process, then started to run away but then doubled back and charged the officer, it's going to be hard to prove the officer wasn't justified in shooting.  

“This one here looks like his head was bent downward,” Baden told The New York Times. “It can be because he’s giving up, or because he’s charging forward at the officer.”

Last edited by forsberg_us (8/18/2014 4:09 pm)

don.rob11 wrote:

Yes , I have seen that video earlier today . Baden's assesment and the Brown family lawyers conclusions don't seem to jive .......

How do you know a lawyer's lying?  His lips are moving.  

"While we're at it, maybe the police should give up their guns"

You mean like in England, where the murder rate is about 1/100th of what it is in the U.S.? That would also probably have to involve the citizenry giving up their guns, and you know how cranky the NRA gets whenever someone suggests infringing upon its (mis)interpretation of the Second Amendment.

Alz touched on something earlier that I can't stop thinking about. I think any state that wants to leave the country ought to be able to do so. By popular vote, of course. The condition is you have to reimburse the federal government for all past federal aid.
Take Alabama, for instance. All they have to do it cut us a check, and they can resume all the "state's rights" they lost in the Civil War. Bring back slavery. Whippings. Lychings. The mullet. Lynyrd Skynyrd. Erect a statue of Bull Connor in downtown Birmingham. You're a foreign country now. Do what you want.
And, really, who would miss Alabama if it seceded again? You'd have to show a passport if you drove from, say Atlanta to New Orleans, but wouldn't you really just rather fly, anyway? I suppose I'd never get to see the Iron Bowl in person, but who cares? I have an HD television.

artie_fufkin wrote:

"Im sure the officers that work that area understand it just fine."

If a cop with six years of experience is firing six shots at an unarmed teenager, apparently not.

So you would get your ass kicked by a 6 4, 300lb man?