artie_fufkin wrote:

forsberg_us wrote:

The problem with this team is for 3 years they've succeeded by doing something exceptional--something that can't be counted on from year to year.  In 2013, they had a ridiculous batting average with RISP.  In 2014, they won the division by winning almost 2/3 of their games in the division.  In 2015, they had a team ERA under 3.00.  None of those things are sustainable.

If this team doesn't do something exceptional, it's at best an above-average team.  The problem is, I don't see where they can do anything exceptional.

I'd really like to sit down an have a beer with Moz (in his case, probably a Chardonnay) and figure out the concept behind the construction of the offense.  They don't have any real power, and they don't have any real speed.  In most innings they need 3 hits to simply score 1 run.  It isn't a sustainable formula for success.

Some institutional arrogance has set in. Not to pick on Gyorko, who I think can be an effective option at second base (though they already have a second baseman, but I digress), but it's ludicrous to think they can just plug him in at shortstop because they're both middle infield positions. Yeah, I know they went out and got another guy and they have Diaz there, but if there's one thing that's constant in the sport after the need for pitching, it's the need for strong defense up the middle.
I want to know what happens when Grichuk gets hurt. Pham is - surprise - already on the DL. So when Grichuk joins him there, who plays center? Piscotty? Hazelbaker? Is there someone in Memphis they can call up?
 

Probably Charlie Tilson, but I get your point.

Just saw where Marco Gonzalez is being sent to an expert regarding his elbow. Always a good sign.

artie_fufkin wrote:

tkihshbt wrote:

Eh, that's probably going too far. I'd pick quite a few guys. Piscotty is definitely going to be a hitter. And throwing out McCutchen? That's insane. Molina is still great when the dummy in the dugout doesn't write his name fifth in the lineup.

I'd take Rosenthal over just about any closer not named Aroldis Chapman.

Considering there are 30 teams yeah id probably end up with a few cardinals or players not any better then what the cardinals field.  I believe if Peralta was still healthy and if they added a middle of the order hitter this lineup would be fine.  If heyward was on this team I dont see how it would change the offensive side of things.  It is cespedes or (as tk said) upton that they are missing.  The sad thing is they both went for a price the cards could afford.

The only hope I see for this team is to claw their way to the trade deadline in contintion.  Then mo is going to have to pull something off.
 

forsberg_us wrote:

I'd really like to sit down an have a beer with Moz (in his case, probably a Chardonnay) and figure out the concept behind the construction of the offense.  They don't have any real power, and they don't have any real speed.  In most innings they need 3 hits to simply score 1 run.  It isn't a sustainable formula for success.

You nailed it with "institutional arrogance." They envisioned Grichuk and Piscotty blooming into cornerstone players and the older players either having bounce back years or continuing steady production. I maintain that their biggest mistakes was not not chasing David Price; it was not not giving Heyward three opt-outs instead of two; it was not not passing on Chris Davis or Yoenis Cespedes, but actually passing on Justin Upton. Upton has his issues and he's not necessarily an elite hitter, but he's a very good one who would've brought consistent right-handed power to the lineup. The Tigers pick him up for a ridiculously reasonable deal and the Cardinals bank on Grichuk, Piscotty, Holliday, Pham and...Hazelbaker? Peguero? Anthony Garcia? Charlie Tilson?

They could have even picked up Dexter Fowler, who can play three outfield positions and would be a better second-string center fielder than Pham or -- surprise -- Hazelbaker.

It's mind-boggling. They could have brought in Upton or Fowler, added speed, OBP and power, re-signed Moss, moved one of Piscotty or Holliday to first, dumped Adams and had a team that isn't going to sweat as much if Tommy Pham lasts 20 minutes or Randal Grichuk hurts himself weightlifting.

What I meant was not chasing him to where the Red Sox were and saying that it wasn't a mistake to go that far.