Weaver left Wednesday's Grapefruit League start with an undisclosed injury.
He left the game with the trainer, but it is unclear what the exact nature of the injury is. More information will be available after the game. Weaver is currently battling for the fifth spot in the rotation. He missed time last spring with a fluke fracture to his non-throwing hand during batting practice.

-----Back spasms .

Last edited by don.rob11 (3/01/2017 4:43 pm)

Spring training is boring.  No battles for position.  Lack luster expectations.  The revelation that the clubhouse was worst then thought in 2016.  A manager that will sabotage any shred of hooe that appears...  not much to talk about.

Rosey scratched from Monday start
https://www.fanragsports.com/news/cardinals-trevor-rosenthal-scratched-monday-start/

artie_fufkin wrote:

"Rosenthal called it 'frustrating.'"

So now he knows what it's like watching him pitch.

 
And we have a winner !

Monday box
http://m.mlb.com/gameday/cardinals-vs-twins/2017/03/06/509787?#game=509787,game_state=final,game_tab=box

APIAD wrote:

Mags wrote:

APIAD wrote:

Spring training is boring. No battles for position. Lack luster expectations. The revelation that the clubhouse was worst then thought in 2016. A manager that will sabotage any shred of hooe that appears... not much to talk about.

I believe this is the second time I've seen a reference to club house problems, or maybe I just dreamed it.  What sort of problems?

Where were they reported?
 

It has been reported vaguely. I think alot of it is on matheny. The way he has handled the younger players like wong and grichuk. The way he favors his guys. The feeling success doesnt lead to success.

Wong hasn't always helped himself with his brain cramps, but the organization deserves some of the blame for his inconsistency. They send him to Memphis to become and outfielder, he comes back and plays four games in the outfield, and then he's back to second base for the rest of the season. Most if not all of Grichuk's problems are of his own doing. If he can't learn to lay off that slider down and away, this is going to be his last year with the Cardinals.
That being said, Matheny passed the point of no return for me when Moz admitted during last season's post-mortem press conference that there were too many players with similar skills on the roster and Matheny got confused. Matheny was a major league baseball player for a dozen years. He's been a manager for five years. There's nothing new this guy is going to learn. 

APIAD wrote:

I agree with your criticism of wong and grichuk but i can see how younger players on the team would see it as hypocritical. You see guys like carp and molina struggle for months at a time or just clearly need a breather and continue to get starts. Sometime ago, but allen craig had to be exiled for matheny to stop starting him. Idk but i could see that as being an issue.

I believe there was several storys on wainwright not being pleased with the lack of work he recieved in spring training. This year he has requested more.

Maybe the players just see mathenys errors and are tired of a boss that doesnt know wtf he is doing.

I think there's a lot of truth to this post.

There was a pretty large group of veterans last season who were unhappy with the way things were handled starting in spring training.  Matheny made a decision that he was going to take it easy on his regulars because they were making it to post-season every year and he believed they were fatigued.  Players complained that they weren't doing enough drills, that they weren't given an opportunity to properly prepare and then the team came north and looked like the Keystone Cops.  Fairly or unfairly, a lot of the blame for the sloppy play was heaped on Matheny's decision to relax spring training.

In addition, there have been a few pieces written or interviews had where players have referred to "cliques" on the team.  If you're in the right clique, your spot on the team and in the lineup is secure.  If not, then hang on.  AP brought up Allen Craig.  You may remember that despite how bad he suddenly became, Matheny refused to remove him from the lineup and it took an act of Congress to get Craig removed from the 4 spot.  Craig was traded because it was the only way Moz could get Matheny to play Tavares instead of Craig.

That same season, Matheny insisted on giving starts to Mark Ellis instead of Wong during the season Wong performed his best.

Just last season alone there was:

- Matheny refuses to actually "manage" Molina, instead allowing Molina to decide when he takes a day off.  As a result, a 34 year old catcher caught the most innings of his career last season.

- the Cardinals told anyone who would listen that Grichuk was the heir-apparent in CF.  The MLB Network bought in so heavily that Grichuk was ranked in the top 50 in all players in the major leagues.  After starting the season 1 for 9, Grichuk was benched in game 3.

- the fact that Diaz was still hitting 8th well into May despite the fact he was hitting over .400 while Holliday and his .230 average remained firmly planted in the 3rd spot in the lineup.

- The inexplicable decision to continue to start Brandon Moss down the stretch despite the fact he finished the season mired in a bit of a slump (10 for 106 after August 26).

- both Wong and Grichuck picked up additional miles making two stops each in Memphis

- Moz's post-season press conference during which Moz said that he couldn't give Matheny a deep bench, because Matheny couldn't figure out how to manage the excess talent.  The translation was that Matheny was better having 5 Pete Kozma's on the bench because at least then Matheny knew who the bench players and starters were.  

I'm not defending Wong or Grichuk, but I think I could see where they might see a bit of a double standard

Tuesday box

http://m.mlb.com/gameday/marlins-vs-cardinals/2017/03/07/509948?#game=509948,game_state=final,game_tab=box

At least in theory, lightening the load during ST so the players don't get worn down makes sense. And I'm sorry. If Adam Wainwright and Matt Holliday don't know what they need to do to prepare, that's mostly on them, not on the manager. I can't speak to the cliques or exclusivity in the Cardinals' clubhouse, but for christ's sake, it's a professional baseball team made up of adult men, not a Cub Scouts pack. I've been in situations where I haven't like people I've played with, and almost everyone can relate to a scenario at work where you want to kill the guy at work in the next cubicle, but you make it work.

artie_fufkin wrote:

At least in theory, lightening the load during ST so the players don't get worn down makes sense. And I'm sorry. If Adam Wainwright and Matt Holliday don't know what they need to do to prepare, that's mostly on them, not on the manager. I can't speak to the cliques or exclusivity in the Cardinals' clubhouse, but for christ's sake, it's a professional baseball team made up of adult men, not a Cub Scouts pack. I've been in situations where I haven't like people I've played with, and almost everyone can relate to a scenario at work where you want to kill the guy at work in the next cubicle, but you make it work.

I dont think you can compare regular jobs to a baseball team.  I mean the cards had a successful year last year by some standards.  86 wins or whatever, was better then a majority of teams.  Im sure dewallet is a little fuller.  In sports a good year isnt measured by anything but competing for championships.  I believe you played on some teams that the players didnt see eye to eye.  Were you guys successful and if you were that doesnt mean every team can manage themselfs in that manner.  In sports, teams are trying to do better then the ones they are competing against and having a good cluehouse can be the x factor it seems.  Not always but often.


It sort of like if you and i both have a hot dog stand.  Selling 100 hot dogs a day is a good day.  I sell 100 and you sell 101.  In a business model we both had good days.  I dont care you sold one more hot dog.  In baseball i lost and i have to knit pick my business to figure out why you sold a hot dog more then me.  Was it my booth front, my meth mouth, the fact i was parked over a sewer drain?  How can i sell more then you tomorrow?

 "believe you played on some teams that the players didnt see eye to eye.  Were you guys successful and if you were that doesnt mean every team can manage themselfs in that manner."

I honestly don't think it made a lick of difference. I played on good teams where there were cliques, I played on bad teams where everyone got along. In college, I played with a pitcher who complete sociopath. If you forgot to lock your locker, he'd take your wallet. No one on the team could stand him. But everyone set that aside when he was throwing a 2-hit shutout.
The Oakland A's of the '70s used to beat the crap out of each other, and they had one of the best runs in the history of the sport. Talent is the overriding principle. 

"It sort of like if you and i both have a hot dog stand.  Selling 100 hot dogs a day is a good day.  I sell 100 and you sell 101.  In a business model we both had good days.  I dont care you sold one more hot dog.  In baseball i lost and i have to knit pick my business to figure out why you sold a hot dog more then me.  Was it my booth front, my meth mouth, the fact i was parked over a sewer drain?  How can i sell more then you tomorrow?"

Great comparison.

Unfortunately i can testify to religion being a division in the work place.  A majority of peolpe are religious to a certain extent.  Some vocal and some not so much.  When your religious rank effects viewed job performance it is a bad thing. Like fors i cant say this is the case or not.  I would bet money that the religious undertone of matheny has rubbed some the wrong way.

Ive grown more and more fond of tlr since he left the team.  The guy was a true leader with a work ethic that was unquestionably.  He was loyal to his players but demanded accountability in them as well as himself.  Im sure it was something that took time to develop and maybe matheny will get there.

Dexter seems like a happy go lucky type of guy.  Not an asshole.  I think this team needs an asshole.  Id still be okay with angel pagan and i think the chip on joey bats shoulder would have helped as well.  There is a reason nice guys finish last.

http://www.101sports.com/2017/03/08/positive-sign-cardinals-camp-mike-matheny-trying-grow-evolve/